I get tired of this
Wed, October 11, 2017 I get tired of watching videos of cyclists who just stand passively by and allow someone to sucker punch them, and not retaliate. You are allowed to defend yourself.
In this case you have an old guy probably in his sixties with a belly, assaults what appears to be a super fit athlete, probably half his age, who does nothing but take the guy’s number. What a pussy.
If someone approaches you under these circumstances, it is highly probable they will take a swing at you. At least attempt to block it, or stick your head down so he punches your helmet. After all, helmets are for protection.
You notice the old guy gets in one, possibly two punches, and then goes to get back in his truck. The assailant probably realized he had taken on a bigger and younger man. The cyclist should never have allowed the old guy to leave the scene. But hold him there until the cops came.
He could have got in the old guy’s face verbally, and he probably would have backed down. If the truck driver fought back physically, the cyclist appears to be the stronger of the two and could have restrained him and taken his keys.
There are those who will say, the cyclist did everything right in accordance with the law. Possibly, but he could have done more than just stand there and take it, and still stayed within the law.
Grow some balls and stand up for yourself. If it were me I would be ashamed to have this video out there.
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Reader Comments (30)
I agree with the sentiment but perhaps the possible outcomes which I am sure occurred to the cyclist might be that if he puts down the other guy he has to make sure the guy doesn't get back up, get in his truck and kill him with it. Or some other driver takes this guy's side and use their car in the same way, or maybe take it out on any other cyclists they see. Also it wasn't his video, and he doesn't have evidence and may not know that the guy with the dash cam is recording all of this. Life is hard and you have arseholes like that to deal with on top of it.
This happened in America! How does he know the old man doesnt have a gun in his truck or on his person??
ayjaydee,
How does the old man know the cyclist doesn't have a gun?
Had it been a motor cyclist on a Harley, instead of a cyclist, I doubt the driver would have attacked him in this manner.
Cyclists are veiwed as soft targets.
Dave
The guy is probably better off in this instance by not fighting back. With video prosecution for assault is a slam dunk and civilly he willl own that asshats truck and a lot more with a good lawyer.
well thats the old man's problem now isnt it? its irrelevant to the subject at hand.we are discussing what is it the RIDER should do. But you go ahead and slug the next one. If he has a gun you can remind him that if you had a harley he wouldnt be shooting you.
Maybe I should get a Harley and a gun, because at 81 years I'm too old to take an ass whupping :)
Dave
NC is a concealed carry state. Handlebar bag anyone?
Great Post. I agree 100%! The least the rider could do is get off the bike and put it between him and the threat and use it as protection. I've been confronted by drivers out of vehicles before and once I see them exiting their vehicle, I get off the bike and put it between them and me. If he takes a swing I can use the bike to distract the driver push him awayand fend off any punches.
i shouldn't be so quick to judge the rider's apparent inaction. Maybe he was laughing too hard to respond in kind, or, as others have pointed out, to respond in kind may have escalated the incident into something worse than a weak punch or two. He's lucky he wasn't run over.
There was a time when if a driver was a jerk, i'd be quick with the middle finger and a word or two, and on one occasion, i dismounted and threatened to sling my bike into their face, but in today's America you never know if that driver is a homicidal maniac. If he's (and it usually is a "he") armed with a firearm or uses his vehicle as a weapon, i'd be just as dead, and there'd likely be no witnesses.
These days if i react at all it's usually just with a big dumb grin and big wave and a "Hey! How're ya doin'?" that really pisses them off or leaves them wondering if they're someone i recognise. i'm too old for that fisticuffs nonsense.
Well, this has been an education. It appears we now live our lives in fear. Fear we might get run down, fear the driver might have a gun. All this in "The land o the Free, and the home of the Brave.
Is it just me, or can anyone else see that when we live our lives in Fear, we have no Freedom, and the assholes and the bullies win.
Dave
Dave,
I have rarely found myself disagreeing with you on things, but this is one where I will. It's one thing to protect yourself (this cyclist might have been wise to unclip and be ready to have hands up to defend), but overtly fighting back only opens a whole new can of worms.
Escalating violence has a funny way of getting out of control. Dumb asses who get out of their pickups to punch someone are also the types to have guns under the front seat. And they're looking for a reason. Look, I'm a 6'2" 200-lb former college hockey player who has never been uncomfortable with contact sports, but mixing it up with a fool like this won't go anywhere good. I would in this instance be ready to get my hands up and protect myself, though.
With the video we see, the police will have a clear case. If video wasn't available, then it's simply he said/he said, and my experience with cops is that an awful lot of them loathe cyclists and have no problem pinning the blame on them.
Funny in our divided country how the truck/bike thing gets more and more hostile. I was at a red light with one foot down a few weeks ago and a jackass in a pickup is shouting at me, "get off the road, you libtard," as if riding a bike is somehow a declaration of my political affiliation.
But cailing this rider a pussy because he had to make an instant judgment on how to handle an escalating situation strikes me as very un-Dave.
Living in fear? No, not necessarily. Living in caution, yes, and remembering that discretion is the better part of valor. Freedom includes the right to just walk away and not engage. Few things get a bully's goat better than ignoring them.
It's easy to judge a person's actions based on a video, but none of us was there and none of us was in that rider's shoes, so really does any one of us need to pass judgement on his character or masculinity?.
Its all on video! Show that when you go to court!!!!!
It's got nothing to do with living your life in fear. You just refuse to see the logic of what these guys are saying! It's not fear that keeps a wise person from stepping into a potentially lethal situation, its common sense. He has absolutely no idea what kind of a person he is dealing with, whether he has a deadly weapon, or not.and the fact the guy is acting irrationally in public gives him a good reason to believe that he may in fact do something even crazier!
Respectfully I have to disagree, if the cyclist were to respond, the narrative would change from redneck truck driver assaults cyclist to cyclist batters old man.
Responding to violence in kind rarely leads to anywhere that either party comes out of looking well.
You're also assuming the cyclist feels comfortable with physical confrontation, not everyone is, a close friend of mine is 6'7, 19stone and gym fit. He will always back down from a fight as it makes him really uncomfortable.
Ultimately we can all say that the cyclist in this encounter did nothing wrong from the moment the confrontation became physical, despite disagreement over whether he could have done things differently, yet remained in the right.
I am clearly outnumbered here, and so must accept everyone’s opinion. I have to remind myself that I grew up in a different era, in a different country. If you punched someone, you expected to get punched back.
I didn’t have to deal with this bull shit on the roads, because no one was stupid enough to pick a fight with a super fit athlete. There were always bullies, but if you stood up to them they would leave you alone, and go after softer targets.
No one used guns or knives, because people didn’t want to kill each other. And no one ran to the police, or sued anyone. We would be laughed at and vilified as a “Grass” (Snitch.) if we did.
Simpler times, with simpler solutions. But I hope it explains why I find it strange a fit young man would stand still and allow and old man to punch him in the face with no attempt to avoid contact, then whip out a pencil and paper to take the guy’s number. It’s like “Hit me. I dare you, I can make money out of this.”
Correct behavior by today’s standards, I guess. Sue someone’s ass, rather than kick it.
More civilized? Possibly. Any more satisfying or honorable? That is still open to discussion.
Dave.
I have to agree (at least somewhat) with Dave. Sure, the cyclist could go the American way, sue, and lawyers and insurance companies will get more money, or he could have just bloodied the old pricks nose and maybe he would have thought twice before pushing someone around next time.
A little attitude adjustment would probably do him the world of good (though at his age it may be too late - some people never learn).
Dave
We'll agree to disagree on this one, but it's also an opportune time to say that you truly have my respect and admiration, based not only on your knowledge and craftsmanship, but on how you've taken your life's journey, dealt with adversity at times, and found a good place. This past summer I rode past a young guy on a Dave Moulton, and it felt as if the bike itself were a person I knew, so to speak. The young man knew nothing about his bike's provenance ("It used to be my Dad's" which is nice in itself), and I urged him to go to this blog. The blog is a real gift to we who read it, and I always look forward to your thoughts!
Lol! a little attitude adjustment to a nutcase in a concealed carry state in a country with more guns than people!! you better pray his attitude isnt adjusted the wrong direction!!
Ed,
Not the first time I have spoke my mind and got myself in trouble. I used to do it on a regular basis. I even got death threats for speaking out against Critical Mass.
What ever happened to that, did it die a natural death? I never hear of it now.
Dave
Dave (slightly off topic)-
Critical Mass is alive and fairly well in my area (Chicago) although every bit as unloved as ever (physical threats from motorists, controversy within the cycling community -such as it exists as a "community")... How it fares over the winter remains to be seen.
To each their own - I've been clipped by cars a few times in heavy traffic and flew off the handle at the drivers, swearing and beating on their window before riding off unharmed. After the adrenalin wore off I felt ashamed for my over-reaction, but at the time there was no rational thought about it - I just reacted.
It would seem that this guys reaction to the old fight v flight was to freeze, not retaliate.
But don't ever stop speaking your mind Dave - that's what we love about your blog!
Dave, read your blog from Mon. Nov. 23rd 2009.
Now, in the video of present, we don't see what happened before the fuck head got out of his pick up....did the guy on the bike do something really stupid to provoke the idiot in the pick up? If the bike guy beat the piss out of the fat ass old dude, would he have given all the people in cars watching that and only that 'the stick"?
Sam,
I never suggested the young cyclist should beat up the old guy, one has to respect age even if he's a dick head.
I have been thinking back to when I was young and full of piss and vinegar, I chased down many a driver who had pulled some dangerous stunt, and occasionally I would catch them at the next light..
I would be angry and give out much verbal abuse, I can never once recall a driver getting out and engaging me in a fist fight.
My point is had the young guy got mad and adopted and aggressive stance, the old guy would have backed right off.
It works on dogs too BTW. Show fear and you invite an attack.
Dave
Until one doesnt, and then its a bit late if he has a weapon. almost everyone I know who gives me that bullshit line about dogs has been bit as well!
Data recovered from cyclist Kevin’s phone:
“Siri, I am being assaulted by a motorist, what do I do?”
“OK Kevin, here’s what I found:”
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I do agree the cyclist's response was good, especially since the lady stepped down of her car to help the rider and other drivers were around. With less people around, things could have gotten worse.
But I also think the cyclist was not mentally prepared for that. Show this video to an experienced bicycle courier and his response would probably be more in line with our man Dave's.
When you go riding out on the road you gotta be mentally and physically prepared for unexpected things like slippery surfaces, a cat suddenly coming out of the sidewalk, an aggresive dog running to eat you alive, and yes, irate drivers who just want a reason to fight.
Maybe having pepper spray in our jersey pockets is a good idea.
People disprespect cyclists so often, it's frustrating. I agree you should be allowed to defend yourself. But be careful. Better to record it and/or file a police complaint
I have been assaulted even on a motorcycle. After trying to run me over (missed), he jumped out and ran at me. I turned into a driveway and rode away down the sidewalk. I had a helmet on, but he was way bigger. I'd rather run than get beat up.
I have wondered about carrying a valve core wrench for this situation. As he's getting into the truck, unscrew the valve core of his right rear wheel (from the side so he can't run you over). He won't get far.
Gouge out the old dude's eyes or at least do the forked finger thing and pray he doesn't remember Three Stooges films.
Then he won't get far. Uh-huh.
Face punchers deserve facial injury or disfigurement.
Oh yeah, they DO. At least a nice long scar.
GIT-R-DUN!